Life is so horrible without God

[Pavel]

I remember when I was a kid it was great to visit church. I believed that God loves us all and everything will be fine. Guys I believed that sinners would get what they deserved and good would prevail. I believed that there would be eternal life after death. But now I look at the world in black colors. If there are so many religions, how can I be sure that the god I believe in is real? How can I believe in someone I've never seen? Why is there so much injustice in the world? I wish there was a God, but common sense tells me that he is missing. I wish there was a good God.

 

[sigma]

a benevolent god would not create hell for people to suffer eternal damnation just because they did not follow him
that is too cruel for someone who loves

 

[N30N]

Hey man, I get you. We've all had our doubts, but if you only focus on the negative, of course you will see the world in black colours. It's doubt that makes faith weak. God does love us, and if you can actually trust in that, then we will be fine. You don't even necessarily need to subscribe to a religion like you were saying. Now of course I am biased in saying this, but try to find Jesus. I'll pray for you man.

 

[N30N]

Hey man, I get you. We've all had our doubts, but if you only focus on the negative, of course you will see the world in black colours. It's doubt that makes faith weak. God does love us, and if you can actually trust in that, then we will be fine. You don't even necessarily need to subscribe to a religion like you were saying. Now of course I am biased in saying this, but try to find Jesus. I'll pray for you man.

I'm happy to talk faith if you ever need man.

 

[Clone]

a benevolent god would not create hell for people to suffer eternal damnation just because they did not follow him
that is too cruel for someone who loves

But how can we say what a benevolent god would do when all man has thought wicked things and God hasn't

 

[sigma]

But how can we say what a benevolent god would do when all man has thought wicked things and God hasn't

god is omnipotent in the bible, he knows all wicked and all good, he has thought and seen it all

 

[Pavel]

god is omnipotent in the bible, he knows all wicked and all good, he has thought and seen it all

Such logical inconsistencies show that there is no God and he was invented by people who are capable of making mistakes. God either does not exist, or he exists, but is unfair and illogical

 

[sigma]

Such logical inconsistencies show that there is no God and he was invented by people who are capable of making mistakes. God either does not exist, or he exists, but is unfair and illogical

yes
different groups across the world worship their own personal gods with different practices based on their own worldview
for example in sudamerica, back then they used to worship the sun because it brought life
however it ended up with them doing human sacrifice

 

[Clone]

Such logical inconsistencies show that there is no God and he was invented by people who are capable of making mistakes. God either does not exist, or he exists, but is unfair and illogical

- man

 

[Pavel]

If there is no God, then what can serve as a moral arbiter for a person? How can he maintain his moral character? Christianity and other religions have greatly influenced our values. Leo Tolstoy said: "If there is no God, then everything is allowed."

 

[sigma]

If there is no God, then what can serve as a moral arbiter for a person? How can he maintain his moral character? Christianity and other religions have greatly influenced our values. Leo Tolstoy said: "If there is no God, then everything is allowed."

people can have a moral sense of self without a god
we can observe the world from experiences and also from science to see what works and what doesnt
not all atheists or people who dont follow god are evil, theyre not all murderer rapists robbers
for example we can look to nature and love for answers without relying on and being obedient to a god

 

[N30N]

If there is no God, then what can serve as a moral arbiter for a person? How can he maintain his moral character? Christianity and other religions have greatly influenced our values. Leo Tolstoy said: "If there is no God, then everything is allowed."

Exactly, and if we want to live in society and actually care for one another, then God provides our moral outline for character.

 

[N30N]

people can have a moral sense of self without a god
we can observe the world from experiences and also from science to see what works and what doesnt
not all atheists or people who dont follow god are evil, theyre not all murderer rapists robbers
for example we can look to nature and love for answers without relying on and being obedient to a god

Well, to make a point, what would you deem immoral?

 

[dextermogin]

u will burn in hell for posting about how hot ur english teacher is

 

[dextermogin]

Well, to make a point, what would you deem immoral?

raping babies

 

[Pavel]

I'm trying to understand the nature of morality. Whether it was the result of the influence of religion or we could already feel empathy before, etc. Many animals can feel love, care for each other.

people can have a moral sense of self without a god
we can observe the world from experiences and also from science to see what works and what doesnt
not all atheists or people who dont follow god are evil, theyre not all murderer rapists robbers
for example we can look to nature and love for answers without relying on and being obedient to a god

 

[dextermogin]

I'm trying to understand the nature of morality. Whether it was the result of the influence of religion or we could already feel empathy before, etc. Many animals can feel love, care for each other.

morals r fake but there are things that r innate like incest being wrong

 

[sigma]

Well, to make a point, what would you deem immoral?

senseless r**e and murder. and murder i mean anything that is NOT in self defense. it is okay to defend yourself and others from harms way
things like robbing others, harassing them, abuse, assault, torture, slavery
it is immoral to harm others
what you do with your own life is your choice, you would not like it if someone say stole from you
and we know this without a god because we understand that it is unhelpful to overall world and if it happened to us it would be unpleasant, also science shows that some things are poor strategies for the overall survival of the population

I'm trying to understand the nature of morality. Whether it was the result of the influence of religion or we could already feel empathy before, etc. Many animals can feel love, care for each other.

we have morals without religion
people know what pain and empathy is, like you said it is visible in animals

 

[Whitepill]

Eh

 

[iblamegnzx]

If there is no God, then what can serve as a moral arbiter for a person? How can he maintain his moral character? Christianity and other religions have greatly influenced our values. Leo Tolstoy said: "If there is no God, then everything is allowed."

you're right

 

[iblamegnzx]

Well, to make a point, what would you deem immoral?

society dictates it, an example can be, be a rapist

 

[Quncho]

I remember when I was a kid it was great to visit church. I believed that God loves us all and everything will be fine. Guys I believed that sinners would get what they deserved and good would prevail. I believed that there would be eternal life after death. But now I look at the world in black colors. If there are so many religions, how can I be sure that the god I believe in is real? How can I believe in someone I've never seen? Why is there so much injustice in the world? I wish there was a God, but common sense tells me that he is missing. I wish there was a good God.

Even though Im from the streets I am a christian and I am a believer. The reason why hell was created is because people have the choice to follow him and be good or fall into evil and reject him. It is fair because they had the option to avoid such a thing. God created humans with their own free will. He wanted us to make our own decisions instead of him controlling us. Because he let us make our own decisions, we have the ability to do evil things or good things, He wanted us to make the choice to do evil and reject him or do good and love him. He wanted to know for sure that we loved him without controlling us to do so as that is what was important to him.

Such logical inconsistencies show that there is no God and he was invented by people who are capable of making mistakes. God either does not exist, or he exists, but is unfair and illogical

You are stuck in agnosticism but I hope you find your way to Jesus.

You say that it is not a good idea to believe in something we can't see. Let's take a look at George Washington for example. We know that he is the 1st president of the united states but we have never seen him. It is what was taught to us. We can see it through history books etc.

So how is the Bible any different. 1000's of manuscripts were created over 1000's of years with each one being found having few inconsistencies. Therefore, if we think that George Washington was the first president through history books, Jesus was proclaimed to be the savior through the Bible which has existed through thousands of years.

We take a look at how man created things such as cars, buildings, and everyday things that you use. We know that someone must have created them. In fact, you probably don't know who created many of the things that you use daily. So that means that the very materials that man uses must also have been created by someone else.

If you have any questions. Ask away.

 

[iblamegnzx]

I'm trying to understand the nature of morality. Whether it was the result of the influence of religion or we could already feel empathy before, etc. Many animals can feel love, care for each other.

it was actually "created" by people, mostly by cultures and beliefs. so there is no exact moment in history

 

[sigma]

Even though Im from the streets I am a christian and I am a believer. The reason why hell was created is because people have the choice to follow him and be good or fall into evil and reject him. It is fair because they had the option to avoid such a thing. God created humans with their own free will. He wanted us to make our own decisions instead of him controlling us. Because he let us make our own decisions, we have the ability to do evil things or good things, He wanted us to make the choice to do evil and reject him or do good and love him. He wanted to know for sure that we loved him without controlling us to do so as that is what was important to him.

most things are predetermined like genes and environment, and god already knows our fate so he knows what babies will go hell and what dont
like for example the amalekite babies + infants were killed and sent to hell because god commanded saul

 

[Pavel]

Even though Im from the streets I am a christian and I am a believer. The reason why hell was created is because people have the choice to follow him and be good or fall into evil and reject him. It is fair because they had the option to avoid such a thing. God created humans with their own free will. He wanted us to make our own decisions instead of him controlling us. Because he let us make our own decisions, we have the ability to do evil things or good things, He wanted us to make the choice to do evil and reject him or do good and love him. He wanted to know for sure that we loved him without controlling us to do so as that is what was important to him.

Yes, God has given people freedom of choice. But you do understand that many will simply be afraid of the torments of hell and follow God only for the sake of avoiding physical suffering. He could not create hell and give people the choice to either follow him and live in love in paradise, or go to a dark place where there are no feelings, but at the same time there is no physical suffering.

 

[iblamegnzx]

Such logical inconsistencies show that there is no God and he was invented by people who are capable of making mistakes. God either does not exist, or he exists, but is unfair and illogical

it does not matter if it exists or not, it does not affect humanity at all, the important thing is what it transmits to people such as, good deeds, being good people, not being selfish, greedy, etc.
God for many people is the way or the light they need to get out of a bad time or head back to being a good civil.
God is not the important thing, but what He wants to teach us

 

[N30N]

Yes, God has given people freedom of choice. But you do understand that many will simply be afraid of the torments of hell and follow God only for the sake of avoiding physical suffering. He could not create hell and give people the choice to either follow him and live in love in paradise, or go to a dark place where there are no feelings, but at the same time there is no physical suffering.

We should instead love God for the relationship he provides, and the peace you can attain.

 

[Quncho]

most things are predetermined like genes and environment, and god already knows our fate so he knows what babies will go hell and what dont
like for example the amalekite babies + infants were killed and sent to hell because god commanded saul

The Amelikites were murderous people who hated the christians etc. Because of their actions when attacking Israel, a curse was placed upon them which they would later suffer the consequences. The infants did not go to hell but the actions the Amelikites committed could not go unpunished and sadly resulted in their deaths.

 

[sigma]

The Amelikites were murderous people who hated the christians etc. Because of their actions when attacking Israel, a curse was placed upon them which they would later suffer the consequences. The infants did not go to hell but the actions the Amelikites committed could not go unpunished and sadly resulted in their deaths.

they did, exodus 17:14
Then the LORD said to Moses, “Write this on a scroll as something to be remembered and make sure that Joshua hears it, because I will completely blot out the name of Amalek from under heaven.”

and the fact is, god commanded them to kill the infants. that is sickening and inexcusable in itself

 

[Quncho]

they did, exodus 17:14
Then the LORD said to Moses, “Write this on a scroll as something to be remembered and make sure that Joshua hears it, because I will completely blot out the name of Amalek from under heaven.”

and the fact is, god commanded them to kill the infants. that is sickening and inexcusable in itself

They were cursed for their actions and the rest of their line would end up being the same way after the attack. The infants were already going to be like their parents. It was their choice to attack the israelites and it ended their bloodline.

 

[sigma]

They were cursed for their actions and the rest of their line would end up being the same way after the attack. The infants were already going to be like their parents. It was their choice to attack the israelites and it ended their bloodline.

what? why would the infants be like the parents? there is no mercy when you dont give a chance to a human being. this is no better than abortion, in fact arguably worse given the reasons

 

[Quncho]

what? why would the infants be like the parents? there is no mercy when you dont give a chance to a human being. this is no better than abortion, in fact arguably worse given the reasons

God already knew what they'd be as I said and they were cursed as I said. It is up to you now whether to believe. But one day you and I will know.

 

[sigma]

God already knew what they'd be as I said and they were cursed as I said. It is up to you now whether to believe. But one day you and I will know.

dont give me that one day i will know, i dont know how many times ive heard people say that, that phrase is a tool for fear/bliss and obedience
and as for babies, they did not choose to be born nor cursed nor killed and condemned

 

[Quncho]

dont give me that one day i will know, i dont know how many times ive heard people say that, that phrase is a tool for fear/bliss and obedience
and as for babies, they did not choose to be born nor cursed nor killed and condemned

I have already given you enough information. You are refusing to believe it and rejecting God. And I am making it clear that if you unfortunately do not figure this out soon, you will know the truth one day and you will be regretful. There are many who know and have heard the stories of the Bible and the truth of God just like you and rejected it. There is nothing more I can do for you. Many people have rejected such information.

 

[sigma]

I have already given you enough information. You are refusing to believe it and rejecting God. And I am making it clear that if you unfortunately do not figure this out soon, you will know the truth one day and you will be regretful. There are many who know and have heard the stories of the Bible and the truth of God just like you and rejected it. There is nothing more I can do for you. Many people have rejected such information.

no not really
more like you are trying to dismiss me and avoid arguing because you dont like it when others disagree with you
this conversation did not really feel productive compared to me and clone, he does not tell me any of this dismissive bs

 

[Quncho]

no not really
more like you are trying to dismiss me and avoid arguing because you dont like it when others disagree with you
this conversation did not really feel productive compared to me and clone, he does not tell me any of this dismissive bs

Persecution I face. I have made my point clear to you on why they were killed, why you should believe etc. I am not being dismissive. I have given you the information you need and yet you still ask the same question. Call this conversation not productive, but the only reason it wasn't to you was because you won the other one.

 

[sigma]

Persecution I face. I have made my point clear to you on why they were killed, why you should believe etc. I am not being dismissive. I have given you the information you need and yet you still ask the same question. Call this conversation not productive, but the only reason it wasn't to you was because you won the other one.

i dont believe i won the convo with clone
i think christianity has its fair share of good and interesting concepts
but i also cannot ignore things that are inherently immoral like killing babies and other stuff
clone is not a loser nor he is a bad person nor did i convert him because that is not my goal
he is also unsure of certain things the way i am, this discussion over the nature of bible and god will not be over in a very long time and neither of us possess all the answers
my goal is to challenge others' beliefs while also acknowledging them
and i ask the repetitive questions because you give me repetitive answers

 

[Quncho]

i dont believe i won the convo with clone
i think christianity has its fair share of good and interesting concepts
but i also cannot ignore things that are inherently immoral like killing babies and other stuff
clone is not a loser nor he is a bad person nor did i convert him because that is not my goal
he is also unsure of certain things the way i am, this discussion over the nature of bible and god will not be over in a very long time and neither of us possess all the answers
my goal is to challenge others' beliefs while also acknowledging them
and i ask the repetitive questions because you give me repetitive answers

So because I am sure of my faith, you consider my conversation with you worthless? You have challenged my faith and I have answered. Repetitive questions will be met with repetitive answers because you asked the same the question. Ask me another one and I will give it to you in detail.

 

[sigma]

So because I am sure of my faith, you consider my conversation with you worthless? You have challenged my faith and I have answered. Repetitive questions will be met with repetitive answers because you asked the same the question. Ask me another one and I will give it to you in detail.

i dont mean the conversation is worthless because you have powerful personal convictions, that is ok people have that. dont try to strawman me w that
and as for the answers i do not find them satisfying nor do they answer my questions. i ask a question, you give an answer, i make another question you still dont answer it. all you give me is cursed babies deserve to die and one day you will understand. srs.