Weedmaxxing

[General Horst]

Both actually, because sometimes cheating is lowkey a thing you do for your own survival if the ethical ways of doing it are inaccessible to you

you dont cheat for your survival
Maybe in the most rare cases but not in the recessed guys case

 

[RecessedCels]

you dont cheat for your survival
Maybe in the most rare cases but not in the recessed guys case

Cheating isn't immoral

 

[General Horst]

Like actually taking meds so I don't have to constantly fight myself to do basic shit and can have a bit of actual peace

why do you think that this qualifies as cheating

 

[SevenColorCrystalBall]

why do you think that this qualifies as cheating

Its not working within the confines of your body and finding a solution, because sometimes its possible to do it without medication it just won't be easy

 

[General Horst]

Cheating isn't immoral

Cheating undermines academic integrity, is dishonest, and can have negative consequences for both the individual and the broader educational community
So yes it is immoral

 

[SevenColorCrystalBall]

you dont cheat for your survival
Maybe in the most rare cases but not in the recessed guys case

Fair, if I'd had more discipline I could have probably avoided some of the crazy shit I've done for last minute exams and tolerated the entire process of figuring out how to do complex things like mathematics instead of just convincing the teacher to bail me out in some way

 

[General Horst]

Its not working within the confines of your body and finding a solution, because sometimes its possible to do it without medication it just won't be easy

would say that thats cheating
You have an issue
you take something to fix that issue and you arent being dishonest or getting rid of integrity so I wouldnt say its cheating

 

[General Horst]

Fair, if I'd had more discipline I could have probably avoided some of the crazy shit I've done for last minute exams and tolerated the entire process of figuring out how to do complex things like mathematics instead of just convincing the teacher to bail me out in some way

this is what im trying to convey

 

[SevenColorCrystalBall]

Cheating undermines academic integrity, is dishonest, and can have negative consequences for both the individual and the broader educational community
So yes it is immoral

Dishonesty isn't really that bad as long as it doesn't ruin the lives of many people and we take academic cheating too seriously, honestly the educational community needs to be punished anyways since its structured in extremely stupid ways that leave perfectly capable people behind

 

[RecessedCels]

Cheating undermines academic integrity, is dishonest, and can have negative consequences for both the individual and the broader educational community
So yes it is immoral

Here's the situation. You're worse off because of low IQ and bad memory. Society doesn't want to do any sort of compensation to make the situation fair. By cheating you're literally just balancing things out. Who cares if it's worse for others? They don't care that YOU'RE doing worse than them

 

[General Horst]

Dishonesty isn't really that bad as long as it doesn't ruin the lives of many people and we take academic cheating too seriously, honestly the educational community needs to be punished anyways since its structured in extremely stupid ways that leave perfectly capable people behind

the original comment said it wasn't immoral to cheat
it def is
is it immoral to lie and betray the trust of people who are tryin to help you? Id say yes

 

[SevenColorCrystalBall]

this is what im trying to convey

Honestly I don't know how much is just me being a shitty person and how much is genuinely something being wrong with my brain that I'm not aware because this is the reality I live in

 

[RecessedCels]

the original comment said it wasn't immoral to cheat
it def is
is it immoral to lie and betray the trust of people who are tryin to help you? Id say yes

"People who are trying to help you"

 

[General Horst]

Here's the situation. You're worse off because of low IQ and bad memory. Society doesn't want to do any sort of compensation to make the situation fair. By cheating you're literally just balancing things out. Who cares if it's worse for others? They don't care that YOU'RE doing worse than them

feeling bad for yourself and expecting other to aswell will get nothing done

 

[RecessedCels]

Honestly I don't know how much is just me being a shitty person and how much is genuinely something being wrong with my brain that I'm not aware because this is the reality I live in

Everything you've said so far has been logical

 

[SevenColorCrystalBall]

the original comment said it wasn't immoral to cheat
it def is
is it immoral to lie and betray the trust of people who are tryin to help you? Id say yes

its only immoral if it requires moderate or less effort to do it the "right way", most standards of morality are just constructs anyways that vary wildly between certin cultures

 

[General Horst]

"People who are trying to help you"

yes
teachers are teaching you
Teaching= help you learn
"help" = "People who are trying to help you"

 

[RecessedCels]

feeling bad for yourself and expecting other to aswell will get nothing done

You feel bad for yourself so you decide to improve the situation by cheating. What's wrong with that?

 

[General Horst]

its only immoral if it requires moderate or less effort to do it the "right way", most standards of morality are just constructs anyways that vary wildly between certin cultures

at that point you'd have to get into the question of is there objective morality or is it all subjectve?
Is there such a thing as being good? bc to someone else you are bad

 

[General Horst]

You feel bad for yourself so you decide to improve the situation by cheating. What's wrong with that?

Maybe you are right
people should feel bad for you bc you are mentally retarded

 

[SevenColorCrystalBall]

yes
teachers are teaching you
Teaching= help you learn
"help" = "People who are trying to help you"

They get paid next to nothing so they barely have the time or energy to focus on students and half of them went to schools that never even gave them the skills to properly do there job, and one quarter just flat out doesn't give a flying fuck

 

[RecessedCels]

its only immoral if it requires moderate or less effort to do it the "right way", most standards of morality are just constructs anyways that vary wildly between certin cultures

This is like telling a human and a monkey to race who climbs a tree faster. The situation is already unfair. Would you blame the human for using ladders?

 

[RecessedCels]

yes
teachers are teaching you
Teaching= help you learn
"help" = "People who are trying to help you"

The teachers are getting paid to teach you lmfao. You're not harming the TEACHERS anyway

 

[SevenColorCrystalBall]

at that point you'd have to get into the question of is there objective morality or is it all subjectve?
Is there such a thing as being good? bc to someone else you are bad

To some people I am probably completely detestable, to some I am pitiable or pathetic, to some I am neutral, to some I am innocent

There isn't really many objective morals besides don't murder without good reason, don't have affairs, don't steal, respect authority as long as its not corrupt

 

[RecessedCels]

Maybe you are right
people should feel bad for you bc you are mentally retarded

You're proving my point though. You're calling me retarded which would straight up mean I'm underprivileged which means I deserve for things to be made easier for me

 

[General Horst]

The teachers are getting paid to teach you lmfao. You're not harming the TEACHERS anyway

this makes no sense
Yes they are getting paid
Does this mean that they arent helping you
No
They are still helping you
And yes if the student arent getting the proper education to the point were they "need to cheat"
so it will harm the teacher

 

[SevenColorCrystalBall]

this makes no sense
Yes they are getting paid
Does this mean that they arent helping you
No
They are still helping you
And yes if the student arent getting the proper education to the point were they "need to cheat"
so it will harm the teacher

Sometimes people just can't work within those limitations and they do what they have to

 

[General Horst]

To some people I am probably completely detestable, to some I am pitiable or pathetic, to some I am neutral, to some I am innocent

There isn't really many objective morals besides don't murder without good reason, don't have affairs, don't steal, respect authority as long as its not corrupt

but what if you were raised in a country whose morals where to cheat , where murder with no reason was normal?
To the person who lived in the country, are they morally wrong when to them its morrally right?

 

[RecessedCels]

this makes no sense
Yes they are getting paid
Does this mean that they arent helping you
No
They are still helping you
And yes if the student arent getting the proper education to the point were they "need to cheat"
so it will harm the teacher

So what if they're helping you? They're working a job which pays them a living. Why would I care about lying to someone who only helps me because they have to? The lying doesn't even harm them so it's irrelevant

 

[SevenColorCrystalBall]

but what if you were raised in a country whose morals where to cheat , where murder with no reason was normal?
To the person who lived in the country, are they morally wrong when to them its morrally right?

Most countries agree on those four things in some capacity so they seem universal

 

[General Horst]

So what if they're helping you? They're working a job which pays them a living. Why would I care about lying to someone who only helps me because they have to? The lying doesn't even harm them so it's irrelevant

this is just straight up wrong

so why would you care about a paramedic who saves your life?
you dont care bc " muh they are getting paid to"

 

[General Horst]

Most countries agree on those four things in some capacity

"most"

 

[SevenColorCrystalBall]

"most"

There's outliers, but even then they agree on them in some capacity, even ones that practice polygamy or have a lot of violence and theft will still have general social and legal rules surrounding those

 

[General Horst]

There's outliers, but even then they agree on them in some capacity, even ones that practice polygamy or have a lot of violence and theft will still have general social and legal rules surrounding those

yes but who decided that those 4 were the "right options"

 

[RecessedCels]

this is just straight up wrong

so why would you care about a paramedic who saves your life?
you dont care bc " muh they are getting paid to"

Okay so which part was wrong? Tell me

Those things aren't comparable. Someone saving your life and writing some stuff on a whiteboard are not the same in any way. And no I wouldn't have some extreme gratitude for a paramedic who did a routine recuscitation

 

[SevenColorCrystalBall]

yes but who decided that those 4 were the "right options"

We don't know, there's just always some kind of rules on those and really the only way to decide on ethics is how much it impacts the lives of most people and not meeting those four criteria generally results in negative outcomes for society

 

[RecessedCels]

yes but who decided that those 4 were the "right options"

Evolution

 

[General Horst]

We don't know, there's just always some kind of rules on those and really the only way to decide on ethics is how much it impacts the lives of most people

brings me back to the point of "objective morality"

 

[SevenColorCrystalBall]

brings me back to the point of "objective morality"

I don't even think its possible to find an actual answer here besides just the fact that evolution and the general politics of coexisting don't mesh well with certian types of behaviour

 

[General Horst]

I don't even think its possible to find an actual answer here besides just the fact that evolution and the general politics of coexisting don't mesh well with certian types of behaviour

true

 

[General Horst]

Fuck all this shit, life would be more tolerable if I gave in and abused things like weed and ritalin so I could actually focus without constantly fighting myself

crazy how we went from trying weed to objective morality

 

[SevenColorCrystalBall]

crazy how we went from trying weed to objective morality

We went from smoking weed during study sessions to discussing whether or not morals are valid thats absolutely insane