Discussion Medial canthal tilt - Is a downturned medial canthus really a masculine dimorphic trait?

[Pendejo]

There is a widespread belief that a downturned medial canthus is a masculine dimorphic trait, however the following study suggests the opposite:

Is medial canthal tilt a powerful cue for facial attractiveness? - PubMed

Medial canthal tilt appears to be a powerful cue used in judging human female facial attractiveness. Its power may be due to its relation to the neotenic and sexually dimorphic cue of palpebral fissure inclination.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

To measure the degree of inclination of the medial canthus, they utilized the medial canthal tilt.

The medial canthal tilt is the angle formed by a horizontal line passing through the lowest point of the medial canthus and a line bisecting the medial caruncle at its lateral end.

Example of the measurement:


It depends solely on the inclination of the medial canthus and is not affected in any way by the lateral canthus position.

Now that we know what the medial canthal tilt is, i will include some quotes and images from the study:

"Sixty-six female faces from a high-resolution database of 18- to 30-year-old faces collected over a 2-year period from the University of Toronto student body was used for the study."

"The medial canthal tilt was artificially accentuated for each female face in the database, using Adobe Photoshop CS, creating 66 very subtly altered female faces. Both the altered and unaltered faces were presented side by side in each slide (Fig. 4)."

FIG. 4. Female face before and after accentuating the medial canthal tilt.

FIG. 5. Close-up of the increase in canthal tilt of the eyes (top is normal,below is accentuated tilt).

"Undergraduate student judges from McGill University were recruited and asked to make a forced choice between the unfamiliar faces, as to whether the face on the right or left side of the presented slide was more attractive."

"Female faces with accentuated medial canthal tilt were preferred 93% of the time over unmodified faces, given that if the faces were equal in attractiveness, the faces with accentuated medial canthal tilt should have been chosen 50% of the time. No significant difference between male (94% preference) and female (92% preference) judges was noted."


Basically, images modified to have a downturned medial canthus were preferred in almost all cases, this led the authors of the study to the following conclusion:

"The experimental data presented strongly suggest that medial canthal tilt is a featural cue of some importance in female human facial attractiveness. There is some evidence for identifying medial canthal tilt as both a sexually dimorphic and neotenic feature. Accentuating the medial canthal tilt has the side effect of producing the illusion of a more oblique palpebral fissure."


According to them a downturned medial canthus is a feminine dimorphic and neotenous trait, i personally disagree with this.

The personal conclusion that I draw from this study is that a downturned medial canthus is neither a masculine or feminine dimorphic trait, in my opinion it is a desired trait in both genders that has nothing to do with sexual dimorphism.


What are your thoughts about this? Discuss.

 

[john]

According to them a downturned medial canthus is a feminine dimorphic and neotenous trait, i personally disagree with this.

I've seen women use make up to fraud a down-turned medial canthus.

I'm not sure, but i think Andreas Eriksen's eye area looks better, maybe due to the down-turned medial catnthus.

I find this trait attractive, but not necessary for being gl.

 

[Pendejo]

I find this trait attractive, but not necessary for being gl.

I am not saying it is not a good trait, just not a dimorphic trait.

Look at these women, they would probably look worse if their medial canthi were not downturned:

 

[john]

I am not saying it is not a good trait, just not a dimorphic trait.

Look at these women, they would probably look worse if their medial canthi were not downturned:
View attachment 13183View attachment 13184View attachment 13185

Obviously they'd look worse than before, if their down turned medial canthus was eliminated.

But it's not going to make that big of a difference in terms of their PSL value imo.

Idk why, but Andreas Eriksen's eye area looks more dimorphic to me, maybe due to his unique eye shape and medial canthus. @Buddy Boyo .

 

[Ethan Asia]

Bro, how these sexy latinas happens to have downturned tilt




It's universal trait

 

[Buddy Boyo]

well it's a masculine trait at least according to the DOM morph

 

[Pendejo]

well it's a masculine trait at least according to the DOM morph

Yeah, that was the first thing I thought and I think the reason why everyone believes the same is because of that morph, however, in the study from which these morphs come, the inclination of the medial canthus is not mentioned at all, so the medial canthus becoming more downturned towards the more masculine faces in the morph might have not been the intention of whoever made that morph.

The study only mentions that males have vertically narrower and more sunken eyes than females.

This is the study:

Mate choice decisions: the role of facial beauty - PubMed

For most people, facial beauty appears to play a prominent role in choosing a mate. Evidence from research on facial attractiveness indicates that physical beauty is a sexually selected trait mediated, in part, by pubertal facial hormone markers that signal important biological information about...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

After thinking more about it, i thought that perhaps having a downturned medial canthus allows males to have a lower lateral canthus, and therefore a lower palpebral fissure height, while maintaining a positive canthal tilt.

Even if this hypothesis was correct, it would still not be accurate to consider it a sexual dimorphic trait.

Definition of sexual dimorphism:
"Sexual dimorphism is the condition where the two sexes of the same species exhibit different characteristics beyond the differences in their sexual organs."

This means that a trait that would be considered attractive in a woman would not be considered attractive in a man and vice versa, for example, wide hips or broad shoulders.

But according to the findings of this study, a downturned medial canthus increases female attractiveness, whereas if it really were a masculine dimorphic trait it would have the opposite effect.

@Rkelly

 

[Rkelly]

After thinking more about it, i thought that perhaps having a downturned medial canthus allows males to have a lower lateral canthus, and therefore a lower palpebral fissure height, while maintaining a positive canthal tilt.

I kind of see what you mean but I'm not entirely convinced.
I can see how it allows you to have a lower lateral canthus but how would that change PFH? PFL and PFH is more dependent on eyeball size and the shape/size of the orbits.
The PFH in this is the same and would probably still remain the same even if they lowered the lateral canthus.

so the medial canthus becoming more downturned towards the more masculine faces in the morph might have not been the intention of whoever made that morph.

I am almost 100% sure that was indeed the intention.

Watch both male and female

They are almost opposites. The male gains definition and downward angulation while the female loses definition and medial tilt becomes neutral.
It cannot be a coincidence.

Definition of sexual dimorphism:
"Sexual dimorphism is the condition where the two sexes of the same species exhibit different characteristics beyond the differences in their sexual organs."

This means that a trait that would be considered attractive in a woman would not be considered attractive in a man and vice versa, for example, wide hips or broad shoulders.

I don't think the downswung medial canthus is sexually dimorphic in and of itself ONLY if paired with a straight, tight, and angular lower eyelid.

But according to the findings of this study, a downturned medial canthus increases female attractiveness, whereas if it really were a masculine dimorphic trait it would have the opposite effect.

Again it becomes sexually dimorphic once PAIRED with a straight lower eyelid.
In the study the shape and angularity of the lower eyelid were never altered as I mentioned to you in the PM's.

 

[Pendejo]

I can see how it allows you to have a lower lateral canthus but how would that change PFH?

Lower lateral canthus = Lower upper eyelid

But the position of the lower eyelid would also change so the PFH would stay the same, you are right.

 

[RAJ GHRANDHICK]

@Nihilus

 

[Nihilus]

@Nihilus

cope

 

[RAJ GHRANDHICK]

cope

Scientific research is not cope buddy boyo

 

[Nihilus]

@Nihilus

the sharpness of the medial canthus is a dimorphic trait , masculin PCT = neutral outer canthus + sharp downturned medial canthus
the direction of it may be gender neutral

 

[RAJ GHRANDHICK]

the sharpness of the medial canthus is a dimorphic trait , masculin PCT = neutral outer canthus + sharp downturned medial canthus
the direction of it may be gender neutral

Sharpness is feminine and downward direction is also feminine (according to actual research)

See the pics the medial canthus are sharp are downturned in the feminine faces

 

[sigma]

I feel like it is an attractive trait for both genders so not dimorphic, and the study shows that females are more attractive with it.
But on females it also looks more low-trust sexy. And typically females with high trust faces are seen as more gentle and therefore feminine, and low trust is associated with masculinity. So the down turned medial canthus is indirectly associated with masculinity but attractive amongst both genders.

 

[RAJ GHRANDHICK]

I feel like it is an attractive trait for both genders so not dimorphic, and the study shows that females are more attractive with it.
But on females it also looks more low-trust sexy. And typically females with high trust faces are seen as more gentle and therefore feminine, and low trust is associated with masculinity. So the down turned medial canthus is indirectly associated with masculinity but attractive amongst both genders.

U dnr it says that faces look feminine with downtured medial canthus

 

[sigma]

U dnr it says that faces look feminine with downtured medial canthus

The study says that women are more selected by judges when they have a downturned medial canthus. Many inferences can come from that study, it does not directly mean or was stated that it is femininity. Your inference/conclusion is that if it is attractive on females it is a feminine trait. But Non-feminine traits can be seen as attractive in females.

 

[sigma]

The study says that women are more selected by judges when they have a downturned medial canthus. Many inferences can come from that study, it does not directly mean or was stated that it is femininity. Your inference/conclusion is that if it is attractive on females it is a feminine trait. But Non-feminine traits can be seen as attractive in females.

You can only state it is a feminine trait if it is caused by high amount of female hormones

 

[RAJ GHRANDHICK]

The study says that women are more selected by judges when they have a downturned medial canthus. Many inferences can come from that study, it does not directly mean or was stated that it is femininity. Your inference/conclusion is that if it is attractive on females it is a feminine trait. But Non-feminine traits can be seen as attractive in females.

Still in the pics the downturn ones look more feminine

 

[sigma]

Still in the pics the downturn ones look more feminine

It is likely other traits that make you think that way or just good harmony

 

[RAJ GHRANDHICK]

You can only state it is a feminine trait if it is caused by high amount of female hormones

Its genetic hormones don't affect it

 

[RAJ GHRANDHICK]

It is likely other traits that make you think that way or just good harmony

Good harmony doens't feminize

 

[sigma]

Its genetic hormones don't affect it

Yeah, but if the lacrimal bone is more developed it can help with the effect

 

[Whitepill]

Yeah, but if the lacrimal bone is more developed it can help with the effect

Hormones can affect bone growth i don’t understand why this wouldn’t affect it

 

[Whitepill]

Yea hormones are genetic but it’s still hormones

 

[sigma]

Hormones can affect bone growth i don’t understand why this wouldn’t affect it

Both estrogen and testosterone affect bone development, and the study does not cover which one affects it

 

[RAJ GHRANDHICK]

Yeah, but if the lacrimal bone is more developed it can help with the effect

It isn't that simple


Post in thread 'I don't understand what cause a long, sharp and downturned medial canthus' https://looksmax.org/threads/i-dont...downturned-medial-canthus.565845/post-9259558

 

[Whitepill]

Both estrogen and testosterone affect bone development, and the study does not cover which one affects it

Well chit maybe sexless is right

 

[RAJ GHRANDHICK]

Yea hormones are genetic but it’s still hormones

U can blast hormones and some shit will never grow unless its some type of growth hormone

 

[Whitepill]

U can blast hormones and some shit will never grow unless its some type of growth hormone

Water

 

[sigma]

He is technically right, different hormones will affect your bone structures, such as estrogen causing bone development, hip widening, and round features. Testosterone causes broader shoulders, prominent features, and density
Ofc both work together to make your bones, everyone has both unless you have some disorder (likely you dont)
Hormones are not stated in the study, it was simply a modification of a picture

Well chit maybe sexless is right

 

[sigma]

Conclusion: most likely has nothing to do with sexual dimorphism
Unless studies prove otherwise

 

[Rkelly]

I feel like it is an attractive trait for both genders so not dimorphic, and the study shows that females are more attractive with it.
But on females it also looks more low-trust sexy. And typically females with high trust faces are seen as more gentle and therefore feminine, and low trust is associated with masculinity. So the down turned medial canthus is indirectly associated with masculinity but attractive amongst both genders.

Maybe, maybe not… idk

What I do know is this study is only capable of informing on the effect of an accentuated medial canthal tilt on female faces.

My quick perusal of the study tells me that it is not capable of informing us about anything regarding the male face (correct me if I’m wrong).

What I would do is try and replicate this study design analyzing both male and female faces both with and without accentuation of the medial canthus.
The result of this would tell us if the effect is same, similar, or significantly different (p<0.05) among the sexes.

 

[sigma]

Maybe, maybe not… idk

What I do know is this study is only capable of informing on the effect of an accentuated medial canthal tilt on female faces.

My quick perusal of the study tells me that it is not capable of informing us about anything regarding the male face (correct me if I’m wrong).

What I would do is try and replicate this study design analyzing both male and female faces both with and without accentuation of the medial canthus.
The result of this would tell us if the effect is same, similar, or significantly different (p<0.05) among the sexes.

agreed. there is not an info to make a massive conclusion, so at the moment it is up in the air. the study including male faces would help a lot,.would also wonder how it is hormonally related and/or related to genes found on the Y chromosome.