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Quality, Primitivity, and Naturalness in Ratings

Tawla

Feeling like a bad bitch • Not actually racist
Joined
Nov 5, 2025
Messages
238
Online time
1d 14h
Reputation
457
Location
somewhere in north america slaying masc ltbs
1777524480115.webp

1777524495096.webp

Images above for context

Why?

For more granular ratings. Some people are rated low, yet they have good grooming, health indicators, or are not perceived as low-class. Maybe a cumulative score for an LTN who’s HQ and NP is HLTN-LMTN. Or you could keep them separate and infer from two separate variables (rating + Quality and Primitivity Theory) where they stand. E.g., LTN who's HQ and NP = has appeal despite being low facially.

This, though, would require some redefining. It would require HQ to attribute good health. And LQ is equated to bad health. I like this because it's already defined that you have poor ratios with an LTN rating. Along with a separate axis (Naturalness) for grooming, style, being organic/cohesive, and posture/expression.

GL but Off-Putting (Naturalness Theory)

There are some HTNs on here and .org I’ve seen who just looked so thugmaxxed/fake-suavemaxxed or overgroomed that it's a turn off, and they usually have little to no ratings despite being good looking. The latter is the comments reflecting that by calling them gay, or rating them lower than they are, despite being GL.

We still have some primal tendencies and wouldn't prefer perfection; this ties into the gay alien look with 10/10 symmetry or a symmetrical haircut (think gay Iraqi pompadour that's perfectly square, or no hair frizz for those with wavy-curly hair). In the hair's case, intentional equates to unnatural.

Overgrooming and being a Gay Tryhard

I've also noticed people who are overgroomed (think gelled hair and sharply lined-up mustache, or 6-inch eyelashes and tightly parted hair) come off as very tryhard that people will not even rate them.

There should be a separate axis for "Naturalness" with these attributes:

High Naturalness

  • Grooming fits the person (no lined-up mustache on a Nordic man or tattoos on a cutecel. Don't dress like a diva if your face doesn't match it).
  • Lived-in presentation (not like they seemed to have done all their grooming right before taking the photo or going out, even if that is the case. Reference: sprezzatura).
  • Presentation does not seem desperate (smirked lips, or expressionless eye-fucking the camera like Tiktokcels).
  • Looks effortless (sprezzatura).
  • Choices match context (E.g., nightlife clothing at a bar)

Low Naturalness

  • Too much grooming: eyebrows obviously overly shaped, though idk if this applies to women; slits; heavily lined beard/mustache/goatee; glossy skin; too much makeup; shiny ivory-white teeth; or again, gelled hair but in the context of you not having a dress shirt/suit on; extremely close shave when thick beard hairs can be seen underneath your skin.
  • Obvious looksmaxxing: contacts that are apparent due to quality or your pheno, surgeries, especially soft-tissue ones, or a face too gaunt despite looking healthy. Any looksmaxxing should look cohesive, unintentional, and natural.
  • Overly shaped eyebrows/hair/beard.
  • Too many accessories (jewelry, bags, sunglasses, belts, etc.)
  • Too polished for the environment
  • Looks like u googled “unique archetypes.”
  • Mismatch between posture/face and actions. Skinny guy cannot pull off a cocky smirk; this is the truth. You need to be highly dimorphic to do it. I remember seeing some Tiktokcel smiling while lip syncing and it was so cringe. Brother, u need about 200 lbs more muscle before pulling it off. Instead, you end up looking punchable.
  • Mismatch between face and styling

Caveats/Final Notes/Examples

Maybe a tendency to accommodate Quality and Primitivity for fine-tuning ratings without the Naturalness axis is better.

The new axis has some impractical examples in the real-world sense. Ofc sometimes a guy working an office job that mandates a suit may get his groceries at Walmart. There are some exceptions, like nightclubs, weddings, and formal events, where being overgroomed is normal.

Though I do believe it has some basis in general and for ratings (reference fake-suavemaxxed HTNs again). You could attribute them to very high primitivity, but then again, some low-primitivity people are a turn-off due to the aforementioned aspects.

It also tries to conflate rating with aspects unrelated to it, which is why I think keeping them separate may be better.

This may be just a convoluted appeal thread, or a convoluted sprezzatura one. Though I posted due to the trend of GL yet overgroomed people on .org asking for ratings or seeing LTNs who could probably get a more granular rating.

Examples

Example 1: Stacy + High Quality + Low Primitive + High Naturalness (IDEAL)


Here is an example of a Stacy who has the High Quality +Low Primitive+ High Naturalness ideal.

1777531082372.webp


Example 2: HTN + High Quality + Primitive + Low Naturalness

Due to overgrooming of facial hair + posture = fake-suavemaxxed but still very GL.
1777532384411.webp


Example 3: Stacy + High Quality + Primitive + High Naturalness

Clearly lives a fast-paced life, given the background, so her styling and posture match. She also has a tousled look to her despite good grooming. Though her Primitivity makes her lose some mass appeal
1777591167848.webp


Example 4: MLTN + High Quality + Mid Primitive = HLTN-LMTN

A case without the Naturalness axis to concrete the first paragraph.

Without conflation of rating + aspects unrelated to it, this could be defined as an LTN who isn't an incel.
1777592286146.webp


Example 5: Chad + High Quality + Low Primitive + High Naturalness


Ridiculous mass appeal.
1777593471152.webp


Thanks for reading
 

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View attachment 341838
View attachment 341839
Images above for context

Why?

For more granular ratings. Some people are rated low, yet they have good grooming, health indicators, or are not perceived as low-class. Maybe a cumulative score for an LTN who’s HQ and NP is HLTN-LMTN. Or you could keep them separate and infer from two separate variables (rating + Quality and Primitivity Theory) where they stand. E.g., LTN who's HQ and NP = has appeal despite being low facially.

This, though, would require some redefining. It would require HQ to attribute good health. And LQ is equated to bad health. I like this because it's already defined that you have poor ratios with an LTN rating. Along with a separate axis (Naturalness) for grooming, style, being organic/cohesive, and posture/expression.

GL but Off-Putting (Naturalness Theory)

There are some HTNs on here and .org I’ve seen who just looked so thugmaxxed/fake-suavemaxxed or overgroomed that it's a turn off, and they usually have little to no ratings despite being good looking. The latter is the comments reflecting that by calling them gay, or rating them lower than they are, despite being GL.

We still have some primal tendencies and wouldn't prefer perfection; this ties into the gay alien look with 10/10 symmetry or a symmetrical haircut (think gay Iraqi pompadour that's perfectly square, or no hair frizz for those with wavy-curly hair). In the hair's case, intentional equates to unnatural.

Overgrooming and being a Gay Tryhard

I've also noticed people who are overgroomed (think gelled hair and sharply lined-up mustache, or 6-inch eyelashes and tightly parted hair) come off as very tryhard that people will not even rate them.

There should be a separate axis for "Naturalness" with these attributes:

High Naturalness

  • Grooming fits the person (no lined-up mustache on a Nordic man or tattoos on a cutecel. Don't dress like a diva if your face doesn't match it).
  • Lived-in presentation (not like they seemed to have done all their grooming right before taking the photo or going out, even if that is the case. Reference: sprezzatura).
  • Presentation does not seem desperate (smirked lips, or expressionless eye-fucking the camera like Tiktokcels).
  • Looks effortless (sprezzatura).
  • Choices match context (E.g., nightlife clothing at a bar)

Low Naturalness

  • Too much grooming: eyebrows obviously overly shaped, though idk if this applies to women; slits; heavily lined beard/mustache/goatee; glossy skin; too much makeup; shiny ivory-white teeth; or again, gelled hair but in the context of you not having a dress shirt/suit on; extremely close shave when thick beard hairs can be seen underneath your skin.
  • Obvious looksmaxxing: contacts that are apparent due to quality or your pheno, surgeries, especially soft-tissue ones, or a face too gaunt despite looking healthy. Any looksmaxxing should look cohesive, unintentional, and natural.
  • Overly shaped eyebrows/hair/beard.
  • Too many accessories (jewelry, bags, sunglasses, belts, etc.)
  • Too polished for the environment
  • Looks like u googled “unique archetypes.”
  • Mismatch between posture/face and actions. Skinny guy cannot pull off a cocky smirk; this is the truth. You need to be highly dimorphic to do it. I remember seeing some Tiktokcel smiling while lip syncing and it was so cringe. Brother, u need about 200 lbs more muscle before pulling it off. Instead, you end up looking punchable.
  • Mismatch between face and styling

Caveats/Final Notes/Examples

Maybe a tendency to accommodate Quality and Primitivity for fine-tuning ratings without the Naturalness axis is better.

The new axis has some impractical examples in the real-world sense. Ofc sometimes a guy working an office job that mandates a suit may get his groceries at Walmart. There are some exceptions, like nightclubs, weddings, and formal events, where being overgroomed is normal.

Though I do believe it has some basis in general and for ratings (reference fake-suavemaxxed HTNs again). You could attribute them to very high primitivity, but then again, some low-primitivity people are a turn-off due to the aforementioned aspects.

It also tries to conflate rating with aspects unrelated to it, which is why I think keeping them separate may be better.

This may be just a convoluted appeal thread, or a convoluted sprezzatura one. Though I posted due to the trend of GL yet overgroomed people on .org asking for ratings or seeing LTNs who could probably get a more granular rating.

Examples

Example 1: Stacy + High Quality + Low Primitive + High Naturalness (IDEAL)


Here is an example of a Stacy who has the High Quality +Low Primitive+ High Naturalness ideal.

View attachment 341856

Example 2: HTN + High Quality + Primitive + Low Naturalness

Due to overgrooming of facial hair + posture = fake-suavemaxxed but still very GL.
View attachment 341858

Example 3: Stacy + High Quality + Primitive + High Naturalness

Clearly lives a fast-paced life, given the background, so her styling and posture match. She also has a tousled look to her despite good grooming. Though her Primitivity makes her lose some mass appeal
View attachment 342471

Example 4: CL + Primitive + High Quality + Very Low Naturalness

Surgery is very apparent; on top of being primitive, he's now lost a lot of appeal. Or could be defined as a CL who may struggle with mass appeal despite his rating
View attachment 342477

Example 5: MLTN + High Quality + Mid Primitive = HLTN-LMTN

A case without the Naturalness axis to concrete the first paragraph.

Without conflation of rating + aspects unrelated to it, this could be defined as an LTN who isn't an incel.
View attachment 342485

Example 6: Chad + High Quality + Low Primitive + High Naturalness


Ridiculous mass appeal.
View attachment 342494

Thanks for reading
not cl btw but nice thread
 
not cl btw but nice thread
Thanks. There's something off about the placement of his eyes in relation to something else, or that his lower maxilla is still underprojected despite the large lefort 2 and jaw movement he got. I do agree, i felt weird giving him that rating.
 

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